President Obama vs Mitt Romney |
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Pinnacle
Forum Moderator Joined: 14 Dec 2008 Location: Dogtown, CA Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510 |
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Topic: President Obama vs Mitt Romney Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 1:25pm |
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Drokun, let me break this down as simply as possible for you to understand what is going on in America. Our Government does not have the money to sustain itself. There are two options at this point. Cut spending and/or increase revenues through taxes, since the economy is not producing. The economy is solely dependant on the fact that people will spend money and through every microtransaction, the government gets tax revenue. People only spend money when they actually have money in their pocket. So let me tell you what this President's solution has been - raise spending. Please tell me how this solves our problems? On top of that, in order to sustain the added spending, he wants to raise taxes on everyone. Anyone that says otherwise just doesn't get how the taxes work. Therefore, people will have less money. People will spend less, which means our economy will start to recede, thus bringing in less revenue to the Government. As a result, the Government, in order to sustain itself, will have to raise taxes again, and again, and again. Do you see the fundamental problem? In addition to the fundamental problem this President's policy has created, the amount of debt he has accumulated ($6 trillion in 4 years) has been unsustainable even for borrowing from China (who own 8% of America) and Russia (who own 7% of America). Therefore, our Federal Reserve Bank (not really a bank) has been forced to print money to cover costs. Well, when you print more money, the value of the dollar goes down significantly. As a result, people have to pay a lot more for something that cost them a lot less before. Therefore, they again have less money in their pockets to spend in order to stimulate the economy. All of this can be avoided by two simple functions. Keep taxes at the levels they are now (in order to create consistent expectations) and cut spending. This consistency will allow people to save money and budget their purchases. It will be consistent so they will know that their income next year will be the same as it is this year. And yes, some entitlements will have to go, simply because we cannot afford them at this time. The biggest being the "Affordable Health Care Act", which is a mandatory tax on people who do not have health insurance. In addition to the people paying for it out of their own pocket, it's going to cost our government an additional $2 trillion in 10 years to keep the program alive. Please tell me how this makes any sense? ------------------------------ P.S. To King and Feh, I appreciate the kind words. Call me uneducated all you want, however, I have a J.D. from USC and an MBA from UCLA's Anderson School of Management. Additionally, I'm a tax attorney. So I may be uneducated, but the company I work for counts on me to understand the fundamental of economics in order to make sure our clients money is handled properly. And everything this administration has done has directly impacted everyone in my industry, our clients, and their employees, including the US Government who is our customer. So let's keep this up. |
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drdeath2point0
Godlike Member Joined: 09 Feb 2012 Online Status: Offline Posts: 995 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 2:18pm | ||||
Well pinn I completely agree with you across the board. Common sense isn't so common :)
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drdeath2point0
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SIZZLE
Team oOPS I'm your huckle berry Joined: 01 Jun 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1352 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 2:50pm | ||||
why is it that the fed is keeping interest rates where they are? so people don't choose savings accounts over investing... people used to save money and make money off the interest, but without an interest rate people can't make any money off of interest so they invest... the fed has their hands in everything... their so powerfull and secretive that the US Presedent or the US Congress can't even make them disclose their members and their workings... they are the new world order and they have been for a long time... its nothing new... the problem now is that they have finally totaly fk'd us all... not by accident either... its by design... they don't have a moral standard to abide by... they're all about power and control, and they have the power... now they want control... they're using their power to the fullest to minipulate everything so they gain control, and most people just don't have a clue
you need to check the history of the fed if you want to know who really has the power... i wish it was as simple as just electing a good Presedent, but thats just not the case... Ronald Reagon acually tried, and some Congress members have also tried, but their just too powerfull, so debating about who would be the best Presedent is useless unless one of them intends to go after the fed, and i can guarantee you that neither of them intend to do that even lthough that is the #1 thing that needs to happen |
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drdeath2point0
Godlike Member Joined: 09 Feb 2012 Online Status: Offline Posts: 995 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 3:07pm | ||||
I agree sizz the intrest on a 2 yr cd is only at 1.5% and that's pathetic. 4 years ago I was locked in at 5.59% on a 2yr cd but I let it lapse and was getting so much flak From the IRS it wasn't worth me keeping the money there.
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drdeath2point0
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FehtalaTee
Godlike Member FehtalaTee Joined: 24 Jan 2010 Location: Virginia Online Status: Offline Posts: 2979 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:13pm | ||||
I'm just here to read what you guys have to say. I'm done replying to some of the ignorant post.
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Me and Penguins about to go HAAAAAM!!
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JPINATOR
Administrator Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Location: Saint Paul, MN Online Status: Offline Posts: 2118 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:26pm | ||||
Out of curiosity Pin and this is no attack on you or anything but why do you think increase taxing the wealthy is a bad idea?
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Pinnacle
Forum Moderator Joined: 14 Dec 2008 Location: Dogtown, CA Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:48pm | ||||
Because rich people spend money. The more money in their pocket, the more they are willing to spend. The more they spend, the more money is out in the free market. Also, rich people tend to hire people to work for them. The more money in their pocket, the more likely it is that they hire people. And when they have a lot of money, they tend to go after talent. In order to lure talent, they provide higher pay and more benefits, etc. etc. etc. Taxing the rich more won't even make dent in our debt. Therefore it's a lose/lose proposition. Would you rather the money stay in the free market, i.e. in people's hands, or as taxes, in the government's hands. A prime example is the corporate tax rates. Since Obama wants to raise it, employers are NOT HIRING since they won't have as much to spend. Pretty simple really.
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Phenethylamine
Godlike Member Joined: 31 May 2011 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2046 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:50pm | ||||
I think it's cause rich people will spend the money and can also create jobs
EDIT- I got ninja'd
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Pinnacle
Forum Moderator Joined: 14 Dec 2008 Location: Dogtown, CA Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:51pm | ||||
Saying something is ignorant without providing facts is in and of itself ignorant. I'm all for a good conversation, so bring some facts to the table and let's discuss.
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JPINATOR
Administrator Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Location: Saint Paul, MN Online Status: Offline Posts: 2118 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 7:26pm | ||||
You had me at hello.... you had me.... at .... hello |
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SIZZLE
Team oOPS I'm your huckle berry Joined: 01 Jun 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1352 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 7:29pm | ||||
lmao
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Aquaknot
Godlike Member Wheres my sock?! Joined: 22 Feb 2010 Online Status: Offline Posts: 778 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 8:27pm | ||||
Ordinarily, I stay out of discussions like this. Pinnacle is exactly right. This is Econ 101. Many businesses actually have cash on hand, but are not hiring because the Government has made it abundantly clear that taxes are going up for Corporations. We're scared to death. Since VP Biden is running around declaring that they want $1 Trillion in taxes from businesses and the wealthy, nobody in their right mind will risk their resources in payroll or product development because they have no idea what their future tax bill is going to be. Everyone has shifted to JIT for product delivery because they don't want their cash tied up in stock. As an aside; $1 trillion dollars looks like this: it represents $1,000 for every single human being that has lived and died in the past 2,000 years. This is not a small number. The U.S. Debt stands at $4,500 for every person who has lived and died in the past 2,000 years. I'm surprised people still lend us money. Don't kid yourself about who the liberals consider "wealthy". While they bash millionaires for achieving the American dream, they have stated that they are going after households making $250k or more. Those are not millionaires. I have never been hired by a poor person. It's just the truth. I have hired plenty of poor people and have paid them a fair wage for their labor though. If we tax the wealthy out of existence, who is going to hire you? Why do we say "work hard to achieve the American dream" and then vilify everyone who actually does? Better yet, why do we purchase the goods and services of these companies and then get pissed when they make a profit? Check this out: The liberals say that the rich need to pay more and that we're all in the same boat. See if you can follow this logic...
That's our CURRENT tax system in America. And those 2 people that are rowing for 7 out of every 10 hours are not doing enough? Seriously? They should row even more? We don't have a revenue problem. We have a bad spending habit.
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A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
-- Thomas Jefferson |
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FehtalaTee
Godlike Member FehtalaTee Joined: 24 Jan 2010 Location: Virginia Online Status: Offline Posts: 2979 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 9:48pm | ||||
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Me and Penguins about to go HAAAAAM!!
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FehtalaTee
Godlike Member FehtalaTee Joined: 24 Jan 2010 Location: Virginia Online Status: Offline Posts: 2979 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 9:56pm | ||||
I get it, now I see where people are coming from when they they vote for Mitt.
Aqua, tell me the difference between, Mitt and Bush.
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Me and Penguins about to go HAAAAAM!!
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JPINATOR
Administrator Joined: 29 Mar 2011 Location: Saint Paul, MN Online Status: Offline Posts: 2118 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 11:34pm | ||||
You know that **** just got real once Aqua showed up!
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ax412
Team iAM Duel Champ Joined: 29 Jan 2009 Location: Cali Online Status: Offline Posts: 4833 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 8:56am | ||||
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drdeath2point0
Godlike Member Joined: 09 Feb 2012 Online Status: Offline Posts: 995 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 10:02am | ||||
So you calling me out feh? Really : / |
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drdeath2point0
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Aquaknot
Godlike Member Wheres my sock?! Joined: 22 Feb 2010 Online Status: Offline Posts: 778 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 10:47am | ||||
I am not an apologist for Bush. Neither am I particularly fond of Romney. I did find it interesting that Romney broke an Allen Edmonds off in Obama's backside the other night though. Given where our current economy is and our standing in the world today, I would vote for a used tissue before I would reelect the current President. We have so many people in this country that think the wealthy have ripped them off somehow and they want the government to take something from the wealthy and give it to them. Compared to most of the world, the poorest person in America is rich when compared to the global standard. Did you have clean drinking water today? = rich Did you have access to food today? = rich Do you have a car (even if it's a POS)? = rich Do you own a shoe for each foot? = rich Did you have access to emergency medical care, even if you could not pay? = rich Did you hav the guarantee of a K-12 education? = rich Do you have the luxury of choosing your political leaders? = rich In America, especially since the Civil Rights Act of 1964; our citizens are guaranteed equal opportunity, not equal results. I have been homeless, hungry and half naked. I have stayed in my car and on my brother's couch. I slept on the floor in my first apartment. I've done meaningless and disgusting jobs. I've been poor and I have been rich. It was up to me though, regarding how far or successful I would become in life. The government hasn't done a single thing for me except make it very difficult to succeed. Choose wisely, but definitely choose and be heard on election day no matter who your candidate is.
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A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
-- Thomas Jefferson |
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SIZZLE
Team oOPS I'm your huckle berry Joined: 01 Jun 2009 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1352 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:10am | ||||
yall might want to check out infowars on youtube... there are different vids covering different subjects... most of their info is accurate... you can ignore their opinion if you don't agree with it, and just focus on the info
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ax412
Team iAM Duel Champ Joined: 29 Jan 2009 Location: Cali Online Status: Offline Posts: 4833 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 3:26pm | ||||
Woah, while I know that UCLA's Business Program is actually ranked higher than USC's (overall). How the hell did you go to both schools lol? Traitor! haha I'm jking, I plan on following a route similar to you. |
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chisox666
Team iAM Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Location: Chicago burbs Online Status: Offline Posts: 463 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:16pm | ||||
Pinn - Gas prices are a complicated matter. I think big business is more to blame (for gas prices) vs it being Obama's fault. The oil companies r@pe us at the pump, and the federal government allows it. Any politician who stands up against these oil behemoths (and tries to procure gas price regulation put in place) can most likely kiss their political career goodbye due to them being such damn wealthy lobbyists. EDIT: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/06/most-profitable-corporations-tax-rate_n_1746817.html The last sentence is what caught my eye. |
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get fragged
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chisox666
Team iAM Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Location: Chicago burbs Online Status: Offline Posts: 463 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:32pm | ||||
Ron Paul! |
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ax412
Team iAM Duel Champ Joined: 29 Jan 2009 Location: Cali Online Status: Offline Posts: 4833 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:51pm | ||||
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chisox666
Team iAM Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Location: Chicago burbs Online Status: Offline Posts: 463 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:52pm | ||||
Yeah I know. It's nice to fantasize though! |
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get fragged
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ax412
Team iAM Duel Champ Joined: 29 Jan 2009 Location: Cali Online Status: Offline Posts: 4833 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:58pm | ||||
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