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President Obama vs Mitt Romney

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Pinnacle View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Pinnacle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: President Obama vs Mitt Romney
    Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 1:25pm
Originally posted by Iuckshot

I think the dutch economy is also still getting a bit worse?
Surely worldwide economy still getting a bit worse isn't to blame on just the american president? :P
I've not studied politics and don't follow american politics so I don't know if he's good or bad at it, but Obama didn't pick the easiest of times to be a president
 
Drokun, let me break this down as simply as possible for you to understand what is going on in America. Our Government does not have the money to sustain itself. There are two options at this point. Cut spending and/or increase revenues through taxes, since the economy is not producing. The economy is solely dependant on the fact that people will spend money and through every microtransaction, the government gets tax revenue. People only spend money when they actually have money in their pocket.
 
So let me tell you what this President's solution has been - raise spending. Please tell me how this solves our problems? On top of that, in order to sustain the added spending, he wants to raise taxes on everyone. Anyone that says otherwise just doesn't get how the taxes work. Therefore, people will have less money. People will spend less, which means our economy will start to recede, thus bringing in less revenue to the Government. As a result, the Government, in order to sustain itself, will have to raise taxes again, and again, and again. Do you see the fundamental problem?  
 
In addition to the fundamental problem this President's policy has created, the amount of debt he has accumulated ($6 trillion in 4 years) has been unsustainable even for borrowing from China (who own 8% of America) and Russia (who own 7% of America). Therefore, our Federal Reserve Bank (not really a bank) has been forced to print money to cover costs. Well, when you print more money, the value of the dollar goes down significantly. As a result, people have to pay a lot more for something that cost them a lot less before. Therefore, they again have less money in their pockets to spend in order to stimulate the economy.
 
All of this can be avoided by two simple functions. Keep taxes at the levels they are now (in order to create consistent expectations) and cut spending. This consistency will allow people to save money and budget their purchases. It will be consistent so they will know that their income next year will be the same as it is this year. And yes, some entitlements will have to go, simply because we cannot afford them at this time. The biggest being the "Affordable Health Care Act", which is a mandatory tax on people who do not have health insurance. In addition to the people paying for it out of their own pocket, it's going to cost our government an additional $2 trillion in 10 years to keep the program alive. Please tell me how this makes any sense?
 
 
------------------------------
P.S. To King and Feh, I appreciate the kind words. Call me uneducated all you want, however, I have a J.D. from USC and an MBA from UCLA's Anderson School of Management. Additionally, I'm a tax attorney. So I may be uneducated, but the company I work for counts on me to understand the fundamental of economics in order to make sure our clients money is handled properly. And everything this administration has done has directly impacted everyone in my industry, our clients, and their employees, including the US Government who is our customer. So let's keep this up.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote drdeath2point0 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 2:18pm
Well pinn I completely agree with you across the board. Common sense isn't so common :)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote SIZZLE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 2:50pm
why is it that the fed is keeping interest rates where they are? so people don't choose savings accounts over investing... people used to save money and make money off the interest, but without an interest rate people can't make any money off of interest so they invest... the fed has their hands in everything... their so powerfull and secretive that the US Presedent or the US Congress can't even make them disclose their members and their workings... they are the new world order and they have been for a long time... its nothing new... the problem now is that they have finally totaly fk'd us all... not by accident either... its by design... they don't have a moral standard to abide by... they're all about power and control, and they have the power... now they want control... they're using their power to the fullest to minipulate everything so they gain control, and most people just don't have a clue

you need to check the history of the fed if you want to know who really has the power... i wish it was as simple as just electing a good Presedent, but thats just not the case... Ronald Reagon acually tried, and some Congress members have also tried, but their just too powerfull, so debating about who would be the best Presedent is useless unless one of them intends to go after the fed, and i can guarantee you that neither of them intend to do that even lthough that is the #1 thing that needs to happen



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Post Options Post Options   Quote drdeath2point0 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 3:07pm
I agree sizz the intrest on a 2 yr cd is only at 1.5% and that's pathetic. 4 years ago I was locked in at 5.59% on a 2yr cd but I let it lapse and was getting so much flak From the IRS it wasn't worth me keeping the money there.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote FehtalaTee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:13pm
Originally posted by drdeath2point0

Maybe the Canadians can touch on how "great" their "free" health care is......and that lame ass metric system ;) hey feh can I have my tax dollars back that sent you to school until they teach you how to spell :) jk most of the kids that go to college don't even know what they wanna be when they grow up. How many still live at home because there's no jobs available for their new skills I paid for?
I pay taxes too reta rd.
 
I'm just here to read what you guys have to say. I'm done replying to some of the ignorant post.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JPINATOR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:26pm
Out of curiosity Pin and this is no attack on you or anything but why do you think increase taxing the wealthy is a bad idea? 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Pinnacle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:48pm
Originally posted by JPINATOR

Out of curiosity Pin and this is no attack on you or anything but why do you think increase taxing the wealthy is a bad idea? 
 
Because rich people spend money. The more money in their pocket, the more they are willing to spend. The more they spend, the more money is out in the free market. Also, rich people tend to hire people to work for them. The more money in their pocket, the more likely it is that they hire people. And when they have a lot of money, they tend to go after talent. In order to lure talent, they provide higher pay and more benefits, etc. etc. etc. Taxing the rich more won't even make dent in our debt. Therefore it's a lose/lose proposition. Would you rather the money stay in the free market, i.e. in people's hands, or as taxes, in the government's hands.
 
A prime example is the corporate tax rates. Since Obama wants to raise it, employers are NOT HIRING since they won't have as much to spend. Pretty simple really.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phenethylamine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:50pm
I think it's cause rich people will spend the money and can also create jobs

EDIT- I got ninja'd
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Pinnacle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 6:51pm
Originally posted by FehtalaTee

Originally posted by drdeath2point0

Maybe the Canadians can touch on how "great" their "free" health care is......and that lame ass metric system ;) hey feh can I have my tax dollars back that sent you to school until they teach you how to spell :) jk most of the kids that go to college don't even know what they wanna be when they grow up. How many still live at home because there's no jobs available for their new skills I paid for?
I pay taxes too reta rd.
 
I'm just here to read what you guys have to say. I'm done replying to some of the ignorant post.
 
Saying something is ignorant without providing facts is in and of itself ignorant. I'm all for a good conversation, so bring some facts to the table and let's discuss.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JPINATOR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 7:26pm
Originally posted by Pinnacle

Would you rather the money stay in the free market, i.e. in people's hands, or as taxes, in the government's hands.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote SIZZLE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 7:29pm
lmao
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aquaknot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 8:27pm
Originally posted by Pinnacle

Originally posted by JPINATOR

Out of curiosity Pin and this is no attack on you or anything but why do you think increase taxing the wealthy is a bad idea? 
 
Because rich people spend money. The more money in their pocket, the more they are willing to spend. The more they spend, the more money is out in the free market. Also, rich people tend to hire people to work for them. The more money in their pocket, the more likely it is that they hire people. And when they have a lot of money, they tend to go after talent. In order to lure talent, they provide higher pay and more benefits, etc. etc. etc. Taxing the rich more won't even make dent in our debt. Therefore it's a lose/lose proposition. Would you rather the money stay in the free market, i.e. in people's hands, or as taxes, in the government's hands.
 
A prime example is the corporate tax rates. Since Obama wants to raise it, employers are NOT HIRING since they won't have as much to spend. Pretty simple really.

Ordinarily, I stay out of discussions like this.  Pinnacle is exactly right.  This is Econ 101.

Many businesses actually have cash on hand, but are not hiring because the Government has made it abundantly clear that taxes are going up for Corporations.  We're scared to death.  Since VP Biden is running around declaring that they want $1 Trillion in taxes from businesses and the wealthy, nobody in their right mind will risk their resources in payroll or product development because they have no idea what their future tax bill is going to be.  Everyone has shifted to JIT for product delivery because they don't want their cash tied up in stock.

As an aside; $1 trillion dollars looks like this: it represents $1,000 for every single human being that has lived and died in the past 2,000 years.  This is not a small number.  The U.S. Debt stands at $4,500 for every person who has lived and died in the past 2,000 years.  I'm surprised people still lend us money.

Don't kid yourself about who the liberals consider "wealthy".  While they bash millionaires for achieving the American dream, they have stated that they are going after households making $250k or more.  Those are not millionaires.

I have never been hired by a poor person.  It's just the truth.  I have hired plenty of poor people and have paid them a fair wage for their labor though.  If we tax the wealthy out of existence, who is going to hire you?  Why do we say "work hard to achieve the American dream" and then vilify everyone who actually does?  Better yet, why do we purchase the goods and services of these companies and then get pissed when they make a profit?

Check this out:  The liberals say that the rich need to pay more and that we're all in the same boat.  See if you can follow this logic...

  • We're all in the same boat and there are 100 people per boat.
  • 2 people row that boat for 7 out of every 10 hours
  • 47 of the people will not row at all
  • 51 people will split the remaining 3 out of every 10 hours between them.  This means they will each row for a total of 3.5 minutes every 10 hours.
  • The 2 people rowing for 7 out of 10 hours have this workload because they provided the boat.

That's our CURRENT tax system in America.  And those 2 people that are rowing for 7 out of every 10 hours are not doing enough?  Seriously?  They should row even more?

We don't have a revenue problem.  We have a bad spending habit.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote FehtalaTee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 9:48pm
Originally posted by Pinnacle

Originally posted by FehtalaTee

Originally posted by drdeath2point0

Maybe the Canadians can touch on how "great" their "free" health care is......and that lame ass metric system ;) hey feh can I have my tax dollars back that sent you to school until they teach you how to spell :) jk most of the kids that go to college don't even know what they wanna be when they grow up. How many still live at home because there's no jobs available for their new skills I paid for?
I pay taxes too reta rd.
 
I'm just here to read what you guys have to say. I'm done replying to some of the ignorant post.
 
Saying something is ignorant without providing facts is in and of itself ignorant. I'm all for a good conversation, so bring some facts to the table and let's discuss.
I wasn't calling you out Pin
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Post Options Post Options   Quote FehtalaTee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 9:56pm
Originally posted by Aquaknot

Originally posted by Pinnacle

Originally posted by JPINATOR

Out of curiosity Pin and this is no attack on you or anything but why do you think increase taxing the wealthy is a bad idea? 
 
Because rich people spend money. The more money in their pocket, the more they are willing to spend. The more they spend, the more money is out in the free market. Also, rich people tend to hire people to work for them. The more money in their pocket, the more likely it is that they hire people. And when they have a lot of money, they tend to go after talent. In order to lure talent, they provide higher pay and more benefits, etc. etc. etc. Taxing the rich more won't even make dent in our debt. Therefore it's a lose/lose proposition. Would you rather the money stay in the free market, i.e. in people's hands, or as taxes, in the government's hands.
 
A prime example is the corporate tax rates. Since Obama wants to raise it, employers are NOT HIRING since they won't have as much to spend. Pretty simple really.

Ordinarily, I stay out of discussions like this.  Pinnacle is exactly right.  This is Econ 101.

Many businesses actually have cash on hand, but are not hiring because the Government has made it abundantly clear that taxes are going up for Corporations.  We're scared to death.  Since VP Biden is running around declaring that they want $1 Trillion in taxes from businesses and the wealthy, nobody in their right mind will risk their resources in payroll or product development because they have no idea what their future tax bill is going to be.  Everyone has shifted to JIT for product delivery because they don't want their cash tied up in stock.

As an aside; $1 trillion dollars looks like this: it represents $1,000 for every single human being that has lived and died in the past 2,000 years.  This is not a small number.  The U.S. Debt stands at $4,500 for every person who has lived and died in the past 2,000 years.  I'm surprised people still lend us money.

Don't kid yourself about who the liberals consider "wealthy".  While they bash millionaires for achieving the American dream, they have stated that they are going after households making $250k or more.  Those are not millionaires.

I have never been hired by a poor person.  It's just the truth.  I have hired plenty of poor people and have paid them a fair wage for their labor though.  If we tax the wealthy out of existence, who is going to hire you?  Why do we say "work hard to achieve the American dream" and then vilify everyone who actually does?  Better yet, why do we purchase the goods and services of these companies and then get pissed when they make a profit?

Check this out:  The liberals say that the rich need to pay more and that we're all in the same boat.  See if you can follow this logic...

  • We're all in the same boat and there are 100 people per boat.
  • 2 people row that boat for 7 out of every 10 hours
  • 47 of the people will not row at all
  • 51 people will split the remaining 3 out of every 10 hours between them.  This means they will each row for a total of 3.5 minutes every 10 hours.
  • The 2 people rowing for 7 out of 10 hours have this workload because they provided the boat.

That's our CURRENT tax system in America.  And those 2 people that are rowing for 7 out of every 10 hours are not doing enough?  Seriously?  They should row even more?

We don't have a revenue problem.  We have a bad spending habit.
respect to you for this post.
 
I get it, now I see where people are coming from when they they vote for Mitt.
 
Aqua, tell me the difference between, Mitt and Bush.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JPINATOR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2012 at 11:34pm
You know that **** just got real once Aqua showed up!


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Post Options Post Options   Quote ax412 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 8:56am
Originally posted by BAIN

Obama has set himself up for a defeat in the upcoming election and the best that the Republicans can do is Mitt Romney? Wow that's some choice we have come November 6th. Neither of the candidates has what it takes to turn things around, IMO. We desperately need a viable third party.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote drdeath2point0 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 10:02am
Originally posted by FehtalaTee

Originally posted by Pinnacle

Originally posted by FehtalaTee

Originally posted by drdeath2point0

Maybe the Canadians can touch on how "great" their "free" health care is......and that lame ass metric system ;) hey feh can I have my tax dollars back that sent you to school until they teach you how to spell :) jk most of the kids that go to college don't even know what they wanna be when they grow up. How many still live at home because there's no jobs available for their new skills I paid for?
I pay taxes too reta rd.

 
I'm just here to read what you guys have to say. I'm done replying to some of the ignorant post.

 

Saying something is ignorant without providing facts is in and of itself ignorant. I'm all for a good conversation, so bring some facts to the table and let's discuss.
I wasn't calling you out Pin

So you calling me out feh? Really : /
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Aquaknot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 10:47am
Originally posted by FehtalaTee


Aqua, tell me the difference between, Mitt and Bush.

  • One is from Texas and one is from Michigan
  • One has been President and one has not
  • One is an evangelical Christian and one is a Mormon
  • One is a successful businessman and one is a wildly successful businessman
  • One admits when he is wrong, one does not
  • One struggles with the truth, one does not

I am not an apologist for Bush.  Neither am I particularly fond of Romney.  I did find it interesting that Romney broke an Allen Edmonds off in Obama's backside the other night though.

Given where our current economy is and our standing in the world today, I would vote for a used tissue before I would reelect the current President.

We have so many people in this country that think the wealthy have ripped them off somehow and they want the government to take something from the wealthy and give it to them.

Compared to most of the world, the poorest person in America is rich when compared to the global standard.

Did you have clean drinking water today? = rich
Did you have access to food today? = rich
Do you have a car (even if it's a POS)? = rich
Do you own a shoe for each foot? = rich
Did you have access to emergency medical care, even if you could not pay? = rich
Did you hav the guarantee of a K-12 education? = rich
Do you have the luxury of choosing your political leaders? = rich

In America, especially since the Civil Rights Act of 1964; our citizens are guaranteed equal opportunity, not equal results.

I have been homeless, hungry and half naked.  I have stayed in my car and on my brother's couch.  I slept on the floor in my first apartment.  I've done meaningless and disgusting jobs.  I've been poor and I have been rich.  It was up to me though, regarding how far or successful I would become in life.  The government hasn't done a single thing for me except make it very difficult to succeed.

Choose wisely, but definitely choose and be heard on election day no matter who your candidate is.
A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote SIZZLE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:10am
yall might want to check out infowars on youtube... there are different vids covering different subjects... most of their info is accurate... you can ignore their opinion if you don't agree with it, and just focus on the info









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Post Options Post Options   Quote ax412 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 3:26pm
Originally posted by Pinnacle

Originally posted by Iuckshot

I think the dutch economy is also still getting a bit worse?
Surely worldwide economy still getting a bit worse isn't to blame on just the american president? :P
I've not studied politics and don't follow american politics so I don't know if he's good or bad at it, but Obama didn't pick the easiest of times to be a president
 
Drokun, let me break this down as simply as possible for you to understand what is going on in America. Our Government does not have the money to sustain itself. There are two options at this point. Cut spending and/or increase revenues through taxes, since the economy is not producing. The economy is solely dependant on the fact that people will spend money and through every microtransaction, the government gets tax revenue. People only spend money when they actually have money in their pocket.
 
So let me tell you what this President's solution has been - raise spending. Please tell me how this solves our problems? On top of that, in order to sustain the added spending, he wants to raise taxes on everyone. Anyone that says otherwise just doesn't get how the taxes work. Therefore, people will have less money. People will spend less, which means our economy will start to recede, thus bringing in less revenue to the Government. As a result, the Government, in order to sustain itself, will have to raise taxes again, and again, and again. Do you see the fundamental problem?  
 
In addition to the fundamental problem this President's policy has created, the amount of debt he has accumulated ($6 trillion in 4 years) has been unsustainable even for borrowing from China (who own 8% of America) and Russia (who own 7% of America). Therefore, our Federal Reserve Bank (not really a bank) has been forced to print money to cover costs. Well, when you print more money, the value of the dollar goes down significantly. As a result, people have to pay a lot more for something that cost them a lot less before. Therefore, they again have less money in their pockets to spend in order to stimulate the economy.
 
All of this can be avoided by two simple functions. Keep taxes at the levels they are now (in order to create consistent expectations) and cut spending. This consistency will allow people to save money and budget their purchases. It will be consistent so they will know that their income next year will be the same as it is this year. And yes, some entitlements will have to go, simply because we cannot afford them at this time. The biggest being the "Affordable Health Care Act", which is a mandatory tax on people who do not have health insurance. In addition to the people paying for it out of their own pocket, it's going to cost our government an additional $2 trillion in 10 years to keep the program alive. Please tell me how this makes any sense?
 
 
------------------------------
P.S. To King and Feh, I appreciate the kind words. Call me uneducated all you want, however, I have a J.D. from USC and an MBA from UCLA's Anderson School of Management. Additionally, I'm a tax attorney. So I may be uneducated, but the company I work for counts on me to understand the fundamental of economics in order to make sure our clients money is handled properly. And everything this administration has done has directly impacted everyone in my industry, our clients, and their employees, including the US Government who is our customer. So let's keep this up.
 

Woah, while I know that UCLA's Business Program is actually ranked higher than USC's (overall).
How the hell did you go to both schools lol?
Traitor! haha
I'm jking, I plan on following a route similar to you.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote chisox666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:16pm
Originally posted by Pinnacle

Obama has single handedly destroyed the US economy and currency. At some point, some geniuses should be asking whether this has been done intentionally to tank America. This guys has a true resentment of capitalism. Someone should send him a book with US history. This country's foundation is pure capitalism. Without it, nothing.

 
This morning, I paid, for the first time ever, $5.09 per gallon of gas. Do you all know why gas is so high? It has nothing to do with oil prices. In order to pay for the debt this dumb**** has accumulated, the Federal Reserve has had to print US dollars 24/7 for the past 3 years. This has flooded the market with US dollars, thus reducing the value of our currency by 50% over the past 3 years. Therefore, commodities like gas, which cost $2.30/gallon 4 years ago, now cost over double the price. Remember, all this without the price of oil changing. Basically, anyone who was making $100K 3 years ago, if their salary is the same, they now have the same buying power today as someone who made $50K 3 years ago. All this why the cost of consumable is increasing since the US dollar is devalued into crap.
 
Let's take this a step further . . . the housing market. The housing market, which is one of the biggest sources of tax income to the Government is in the ****ter, not because of subprime loans, but because of the devaluation of the dollar. The Government, in order to not look like fools for making our US dollar worthless, deflected the issue blaming sub-prime mortgages. It's not like there isn't demand to purchase homes. However because everyone's money is now worth a pile of crap, they can no longer afford it. Their buying power has been crushed. So what's the solution Mr. Obama? Raise taxes (reducing personal income), limit the bank's lending abilities (preventing money from flowing to the masses), and raise costs of doing business (i.e., Affordable 'bull****" healthcare act, raising corporate tax, etc). As stated earlier, the Federal Reserve is priniting money at astronomical rates. If the free market is not getting the money, since there is no way to get it to them, where is it going? Answer: All to the US Government to run up more debt. If people don't realize that they are getting hosed by this President, they are just plainly and simply brainless.
 
So please, someone tell me, why the hell is anyone voting for Obama?

Pinn - Gas prices are a complicated matter. I think big business is more to blame (for gas prices) vs it being Obama's fault. The oil companies r@pe us at the pump, and the federal government allows it. Any politician who stands up against these oil behemoths (and tries to procure gas price regulation put in place) can most likely kiss their political career goodbye due to them being such damn wealthy lobbyists.

EDIT: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/06/most-profitable-corporations-tax-rate_n_1746817.html
The last sentence is what caught my eye.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote chisox666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:32pm
Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by BAIN

Obama has set himself up for a defeat in the upcoming election and the best that the Republicans can do is Mitt Romney? Wow that's some choice we have come November 6th. Neither of the candidates has what it takes to turn things around, IMO. We desperately need a viable third party.

Ron Paul!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ax412 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:51pm
Originally posted by chisox666

Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by BAIN

Obama has set himself up for a defeat in the upcoming election and the best that the Republicans can do is Mitt Romney? Wow that's some choice we have come November 6th. Neither of the candidates has what it takes to turn things around, IMO. We desperately need a viable third party.

Ron Paul!
The two parties have to much sway in the media and easily overshadow him.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote chisox666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:52pm
Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by chisox666

Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by BAIN

Obama has set himself up for a defeat in the upcoming election and the best that the Republicans can do is Mitt Romney? Wow that's some choice we have come November 6th. Neither of the candidates has what it takes to turn things around, IMO. We desperately need a viable third party.

Ron Paul!
The two parties have to much sway in the media and easily overshadow him.


Yeah I know. It's nice to fantasize though!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ax412 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2012 at 11:58pm
Originally posted by chisox666

Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by chisox666

Originally posted by ax412

Originally posted by BAIN

Obama has set himself up for a defeat in the upcoming election and the best that the Republicans can do is Mitt Romney? Wow that's some choice we have come November 6th. Neither of the candidates has what it takes to turn things around, IMO. We desperately need a viable third party.

Ron Paul!
The two parties have to much sway in the media and easily overshadow him.


Yeah I know. It's nice to fantasize though!
America's citizens will have to wake up.
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